Peers in a Pod 3 Kayleigh

The radiant Kayleigh tells all about working as a Peer in Hillingdon. Since recording, Kayleigh has gone on to become an Advanced Lived Experience Practitioner.  This is the third episode of Peers in a Pod- the podcast all about Peer Support work. Who are we? what do we really DO ? how did we get here? In Season 1 Peer Trainer Fiona Eastmond interviews peer workers from across the NHS to find out what makes them tick. Sporadic releases.

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Transcript

Fiona: 0:10

Hi, my name is Fiona Eastmond and this is peers in a pod. about peer support working who are we? What do we do most importantly, what are our favorite biscuits? So welcome to Peers in a Pod. Kayleigh, it's an absolute pleasure to talk to you. I haven't spoken to you for ages. Actually. It feels like years. Everything feels so long with the whole COVID thing going on. Doesn't

Kayleigh: 0:35

certainly does. And it is, very nice to catch up with you all be it through a screen, I'm just delighted to be here and to be connected with you again,

Fiona: 0:44

Tell me who you are and what you do and what your job title is and, all those different fun things.

Kayleigh: 0:49

So I am Kayleigh Reed and I am a senior peer support worker. I'm based at the Riverside center, which is an acute mental health inpatient unit in the London Borough of Hillingdon. And I'm very delighted to be here.

Fiona: 1:01

Question one, what is peer support?

Kayleigh: 1:03

I think to me, peer support is individuals who are sharing their knowledge or their experience of a particular topic with one another in order to help or empower each other through struggles or difficulty. And I think, peer support is something that many of us have been fortunate enough to experience from our peers whether that be in hospital or whether that be people that we share the commonality of using mental health services with. And I think peer support is something that's been a huge part of my life for, as long as I have had a mental health diagnosis, purely from people that I, you know, shared. Time on an inpatient unit with, and I'm fortunate enough to have actually very close friends around me who also understand the difficulties of, navigating their way through life with a mental health issue. And yeah, I received fantastic peer support from my friendship group, and I think it's, it's really important. And you know, that, that we have people that understand us because society can just be so full of stigma. And, and there's such a lack of understanding around mental health issues that sometimes it really is just easiest to surround yourself with people who do understand. And I think that's why peer support is so significant and so important. And it's something we can, draw on from various people in our lives. From a professional capacity, peer support is, also sharing that, journey and that understanding with someone. And I think for the trust that I work for Central and Northwest London, NHS trust it's really important. And it's held very closely that peer support workers have to have experience of the setting that they've worked in so that, the connection and the understanding can be truly genuine. I wouldn't have been able to have worked in an inpatient unit, had I not have been an inpatient myself. So I think, yeah, that just sort of relates back to, what peer support is, it's my knowledge of a particular topic. My experience with that particular situation that allows me to better understand it.

Fiona: 3:02

Thank you. I think that's a really good definition, actually. Peer support workers get asked maybe four or five times a day, what peer support is. We can often say peer support worker or peer trainer and people are like, peer what's peer. Certainly in my own role, I spend a lot of time explaining myself and I suppose, part of what spawned this whole podcast is, that perhaps if I got all of us to explain ourselves just once, then everyone could listen to it just a better define, who we are and how varied the work is and how great it is and how to get into it. That brings me to my second question. What is recovery anyway?

Kayleigh: 3:39

It's a difficult term there are a lot of feelings that surround the term recovery. And I think I sort of had to make my peace with it. As peer support workers, we very much push that recovery is a journey as opposed to a destination. And that's something that you will hear from all of us that is consistent, throughout our training, as peer support workers in this trust and throughout recovery college courses, you know, we refer to it a lot as a journey as opposed to a destination. And for me, I really think recovery is an art form. And I think it's something that those of us who are recovering give a lot of our lives to perfecting the art of recovery. And it's a dance, isn't it? Back and forth. Me or my recovery journey and the various different hurdles that my condition will throw at me for me to overcome just means my work is never quite complete. I once had a patient on one of the wards that I work on. Tell me that, you know, she really doesn't agree with the term recovery and she instead likes to use the term remission. And this is someone with a long and enduring mental illness who, you know, has frequent relapses. And it's just a nature of, her illness. And she, battles with that and she lives with that and she manages it beautifully, you know, explain it as a remission and then having relapses really, I really liked that because it sort of took the blame off of her. And I feel that sometimes when we have setbacks or we discover new challenges in our recovery, we can feel some kind of guilt towards that. Or we can feel that it's our faultand to explain it in that way, I just thought it was such a beautiful way of describing it because it just takes all the blame out of the situation. And. There's a term that the recovery college uses is actually that I really, really like, and it's that recovery recognizes the past. It accepts the limitations of the present and it's full of hope for the future. And I, just absolutely love that term. And I think, you know, I will probably be in recovery for as long as I live. And it's something that I've now grown to not necessarily enjoy, but it's something that I feel prepared for and ready for. And, you know, we start to notice patterns or we start to notice triggers. And the longer, the further along in our journey, we are the better we're able to understand ourselves. So, you know, as much as I've heard and as much as I've said throughout my career, that recovery is a journey. It's something that I do completely believe. And I, I do think that that is the best way to summarize it.

Fiona: 6:05

It's really interesting to hear you talk about remission. It's a word that's often used in physical health. And I have to say, I do loathe the fact that physical health and mental health are regarded as separate because I do truly, absolutely believe they are one and the same. Simple reason our brains are in our bodies. It's not like you can leave house without it.

Kayleigh: 6:30

It's about time that care of human beings is more holistic, you know? We are, we're connected from our head to our toes and our brain is a part of that and yeah, physical health and mental health, there are so many discrepancies between the care that is provided or, the access to support that we're given. Um, but yeah, just when she said she sort of treats it as being in remission for times that she's well, and she's sustaining that. I just Really It just struck a chord with me. And, and I do, I do think of that a lot when I have various conversations about recovery, which of course within our roles, we often do.

Fiona: 7:06

Hmm. There's something, isn't the about the word recovery that's quite related to addiction and alcoholism and things like that. And those illnesses are stigmatized in their own way that somehow it's your fault that you've become hooked on these substances. And that if only you could just put it down, everything would be okay. And those things are not fully and properly recognized as the very serious illnesses that they are. Using the word remission instead of recovery you're right. It takes that guilt and it takes the kind of that, that blame away.

Kayleigh: 7:43

you wouldn't feel that somebody had failed, if they had had a relapse with their physical health, and yet as people that live with, mental health conditions, you know, in some way, society will view it as a failure. And we internalize that so much. I've been through so many different occasions where I've been going well. And I felt that I've really been sort of progressing on my journey and understanding my condition and, you know, sustaining my own wellbeing. And then I will have an episode of serious depression or, symptoms will come back and it, to me. Even still to this day can sometimes feel like a failure. It's just the nature of the beast that I live with and, and every time it happens, I know a little bit more about myself or I know a little bit more about what to expect as a relapse, um, and for them when I'm better for me to see that as remission. Absolutely. Yeah. I really like that. And I've held onto that and I love that that came from somebody that I was able to support because, you know, I do often feel that. As much as it's nice to be able to provide the feeling that I understand. It's so comforting to me sometimes when people that I work with, people that I support come out with things that really make me feel understood. And I think that's really a lot of what peer support is. Isn't it, we relate to each other and as much as I, can offer peer support to patients or clients, they offer it back to me just as much. And they always provide me with a fresh insight or a new outlook that I always benefit from. And yeah, I think peer support works both ways, even as peer support workers, I still receive it from, others, with mental health issues. And it just so happens that sometimes those are people that I am working with professionally, and I think that's beautiful. And that's what keeps me going and keeps me in the job that I do.

Fiona: 9:31

It flows both ways.

Kayleigh: 9:32

Absolutely.

Fiona: 9:34

Um, we've talked a bit about what recovery is, and a little bit about your role and how fantastic it is. What is your most often used recovery tool? Your favorite thing?

Kayleigh: 9:47

I think I have spent so many years, trying so many different things and something will work for me and then suddenly it will stop. And I have to find a new thing that is a tool that I use to keep myself well. But the one thing for me that is by far, my most often used by far just the most. Fantastic thing that is consistently able to help me. the most simple thing in the world. And something that, you know, can never be taken away from me, which is just going outside and looking up at the sky. And whether that's in the day, and I'm looking at a sky full of gray clouds, whether I'm looking at blue sky, whether I'm watching a sunset, whether there's star full skies, or I'm looking at the moon, I think it there's something about it. That to me is so grounding and just to look at such a vast space and realize, sometimes just how small I am and not to ever minimize the issues with the emotions that I'm feeling, but it puts things into perspective for me. for some reason it just makes things feel so much more manageable. And it's something that, yeah, like I say, The ability to step outside and look at the sky. It's hopefully something that I never lose the ability to do. And I think there are many recovery tools that I use music was probably my second biggest one's most important thing in the world to me, but you know, if I were to not have access to. Spotify or something like that, or my listening to music, you know, then that, that luxury would be taken away from me. So just, yeah, stepping outside, taking in how vast the world is, you know, if I can stand in a big, field where I've got a huge view of the sky, all I'm thinking about is, you know, what's around me and I'm looking up and I'm looking for patterns in the clouds or patterns in the stars. And it's just something that has never failed me yet. And I remember my, auntie saying to me when I was really young, when I was a teenager and my mental health issues first started she's the, to me, the most important place in the world is a step.Just step. find a step and sit on it, find something and sit on it outside and look around you. And I never understood that until years later. And now as an adult, it's something that. I just need to take a deep breath, step outside, breathe it out into the universe and just hope that it's going to be okay. And yeah, I would highly recommend it. I watched the sunset with my friends so often and I think actually lockdown and this pandemic that we've been dealing with has been incredibly difficult, but one thing that it hasn't taken away from me is just the ability to step outside and take in what's around me. And I think, yeah, that is just something that I use very often, daily in fact,

Fiona: 12:36

that's lovely. Something from everybody who shared so far, which is not, not very many something that's particularly struck me about tools of peer support workers in particular is how simple

Kayleigh: 12:51

they are yeah, it's the ones that can't fail us are the ones that are only going to`work. And I think as people who are, at some point in their recovery journey, enough to be able to sort of sustain employment as peer support workers, it, you can assume safely that many of us would have, tried every trick in the book. I always default back to what is the most simple, what hasn't failed me yet and it's that, and, you know, don't get me wrong. There are some times when, even that I'm huffing and puffing and I'm staring at the stars and it's just still not helping, but it's always the place that I'll start before I do anything else before I put some music on before I start knitting, you know, there are so many things in my recovery toolbox, but that's my first go-to.

Fiona: 13:37

Thank you for that. How did you get into your current role what is it.

Kayleigh: 13:43

So my current role is as a senior peer support worker. Under that umbrella falls many, many things. How I got into it is actually a really beautiful story that I've been fortunate enough to share, in many different places with many different people. After leaving school and struggling with my mental health through school and, not. Getting the grades that I felt that I was able to, just because of barriers that had been put in place, I left early. And I gained employment as a support worker, not a peer support worker, but as a support worker, ironically for, the same private hospital that I had been admitted to. Um, yeah. Yeah. That's how, um, I suppose that the first leg of this long journey that I, really didn't know would end up in the beautiful way that it has. But this job was really taxing and it was, you know, long shifts, 70 plus hours a week. And I would sleep there quite often and it became a detriment to my mental health. Then at the time I was 18 and I, you know, at this point was still reluctant to accept, help from services because I didn't feel that anyone understood me and I've walked in to an appointment with a new. Consultant, and this consultant psychiatrist had this big, glowing lamp on his desk, and I'll never forget sort of walking in and you could just tell by my body language, there was no way I was going to open up to this man. You know, my opinion of consultants, wasn't the most complimentary to say the least at this point, I felt I'd been failed at every turn and twist. And I walked in and he had this big, glowing lamp on his desk. And the first words that came out of his mouth were, I hope you don't mind that I have my S.A.D. Lights on. I suffer from seasonal affective disorder, just that tiny, tiny little insight into the fact that he may have some understanding of what I was going through was the first step in me, engaging in me, accepting help, and him sharing that with me. Honestly just broke down. So many of the barriers that I had set up for myself, it broke down so much of the stigma that I had internalized because this high achieving consultant psychiatrist has, you know, his own mental health issues. And from there naturally, I was really able to, open up to him and really start to get help. And I had been discussing my support worker role because it was a role that I had gone into because I think naturally as people who have experienced difficulty or struggles in our life, most of us are inclined to be more compassionate. It's just something that's an opinion. Not a fact, So I had gone into a support worker role because I had just wanted to help people I'd wanted to help people that had mental health issues, because I understood. And, you know, unfortunately upon getting that job, I was told I wasn't allowed to use my lived experience, which is a long and dreadful story for another day. But I'm sharing this in my meeting with my fantastic new consultant. And he just off the cuff mentioned peer support work to me. And it wasn't something that I had heard of outside of drug and alcohol services. I didn't know. The peer support at this point was something that existed within a mental health. And so hearing as an 18 year old, who was actually quite unwell from the stress and pressure of their current role, where they were offering support in such a different way, set me on this journey of desperately, trying to gain employment as a peer support worker I went for many, many interviews without being able to actually gain employment as a peer support worker. And at the time I was devastated about it, but I realize now, hindsight is a wonderful thing. And at that point I'm still so reluctant to share so much of what I had been through what I had experienced, because I still wasn't able to really accept myself that I had needed help or support. So how could I have offered that to others? But it was, yeah, it was a long journey and many interviews, that I was unsuccessful in when I eventually gained, employment as a peer support activities coordinator. And I was there for about a year and a half on a female ward running, the most wonderful activities, uh, and sharing my lived experience within those activities. There's not a role you can't do alongside bringing your lived experience, which is something that I've found and yeah, from there, fortunately, after a year and a half of doing that job and just loving it, I was able to progress to a senior peer support worker role and within my current role, I do all of the things that I did as a peer support worker slash peer support activities coordinator. And I also get to supervise our peer support workers that are, on the wards all day. I get to have fantastic opportunities for group supervision, where I get to come together with numerous peer support workers at once. When many of us feel like we're on our own islands and we get to discuss the various complexities and joys of the role. It's the most rewarding job in the world. I know that I am always beaming and talking about, you know, how much I love my job, but I truly, when we talk about recovery tools and, and what's helped me along my journey of recovery, my job is such a huge part of that. Never thought I would really manage to. Sustain long-term employment because the, you know, I had various roles throughout my sort of earlier years. And then I had years of unemployment because I just couldn't get a grip on what it was that would keep me well. And this role certainly has, contributed a lot in terms of me staying well. And I think that comes from not only being accepted in spite of my mental health difficulties, but being accepted and valued because of my mental health difficulties

Fiona: 19:49

Definitely

Kayleigh: 19:50

What a difference that makes to someone's self worth and someone's belief in themselves. And I think a lot of the time, it just takes someone to believe in you for you to fulfill your potential I will never. Stop being grateful for, you know, the first consultant that thought I might make great peer support worker or the first manager, that gave me my first role as a peer support worker and yeah. Everyone on this journey that has allowed me to do what I do. I'm eternally grateful too, because my God do, I love it.

Fiona: 20:23

excellent. Have you got any shout-outs

Kayleigh: 20:26

I would absolutely give a big shout out to Verity Berry who was the ward manager of crane ward, which is the first, peer support worker role that I had. And the short time that she was, my manager really helped me to see my potential and really helped me to, I don't know, sharpen up my skills and pushed me and really believed in me and encouraged me to take on various different things that I otherwise would have been too petrified to consider. Um, so yeah, definitely a big shout out to her and a huge shout out to you, Fiona as well, because you were obviously at the time, um, also senior peer support worker in the same borough, but the community equivalent to my role and you taught me so much during the time that we worked together I felt just so wonderful that I got to share the Borough of Hillingdon with someone so, knowledgeable and experienced and patient and innovative. And yet you taught me so so much. And yeah, there were a lot of things that I've learned from you that will carry me through

Fiona: 21:32

thank you. That's lovely. It's uh, it's always nice to hear bits and bobs about various different projects that people either still miss or they're carrying on, or they're doing things that I've inspired them or push them to do. And that includes the peer support workers that I've been, involved with. And I think I was in the perfect position to give you advice about how not to feel like a total imposter in a senior role, because I also arrived in Hillingdon and thought, what am I even doing? And as I do, and as you do, actually, and I think we both did is I made the role, my own, I. Took advice and I definitely ignored some advice too. I remember I did kind of make it work and I did a lot of Googling, you know,

Kayleigh: 22:20

I think what you're saying, is so right I think all of us as peer support workers make the role our own, because such a huge part of the roles that we have is bringing ourself to work. And so much of what we do is led by the experiences that we've had. Led by what we're able to share, what we're willing to share, what feels comfortable to share. So every single one of us that is in the same or similar role, we'll do it completely differently. And I think that is, that is a huge part of the beauty of what we do. And for many other roles, for many other fantastic clinical roles that there are, there's definitely not quite as flexible because so much of what we do has to feel comfortable to us. And it has to feel, in some way directed by what we've been through. We all have different morals. We all have different, you know, cultures and faiths and all of these things that come into the way that we practice. And that's very much valued in the role that we have. You can feel like an imposter initially because you need to just, slot yourself into that role and get comfortable with it. And that's when magic starts to happen is when you feel confident and comfortable in just being who you are and providing what you provide and caring less about appealing to. The massive sort of mega machine that is the national health service and trying to fit in there because we are a new work force. There are so many of us now and we're growing all the time. I hope that in many years time there are thousands more of us and that, you and I, or people that have been with us for 10 plus years are really the trailblazers of this. We are the ones that get to navigate this path, and we are the ones to carve out these roles. And we're so fortunate to be able to do that

Fiona: 24:04

There's something incredibly exciting about being in such a trailblazing role and something incredibly terrifying as well.

Kayleigh: 24:11

I think I hold on to the excitement and just brush off the fear and

Fiona: 24:17

dread. Excellent.

Kayleigh: 24:19

We're so fortunate. In the three years that I have been a peer support worker, the way in which we work, thankfully we've got Mel Ball who is our, lead and she has gone such a long way to professionalizing the role that we have and you know, what was rough around the edges, she has helped so much to smooth in such a short space of time. And I am so excited to see what. Peer support looks like in years to come, but I know that at its roots, it will be people who understand providing understanding to the people that need it. And that's what it will be at its core always, but everything around that is being smoothed out more and more every day. I don't think they will ever be an end result. I think this is something that will continue to grow and blossom and mold and change.

Fiona: 25:11

That brings me back to when you were talking about how recovery is a continuing work of art. Are we ever finished, I think we're not

Kayleigh: 25:20

I don't think so either. And you know, as much as in our own personal recovery, we are crafting away at this beautiful piece of art. I feel that peer support as a workforce is also this just beautiful canvas that is always changing and adapting and how fortunate we are to be a part of that.

Fiona: 25:37

So I now have question five, describe your typical working day using only five words.

Kayleigh: 25:46

It's The most wonderful chaos imaginable

Fiona: 25:50

That's just excellent.

Kayleigh: 25:52

I knew you were going to ask me this question. And I have been sat here full of anxiety because I had no idea what was going to come out of my mouth when you ask it, be as natural as possible. And that is what I came out with. And I stand by it.

Fiona: 26:07

You're making something beautiful out of what is there, but nonetheless the beauty is also there. It's almost like looking at something through a different lens.

Kayleigh: 26:18

I love that that is such a nice summary, I described it as the most wonderful chaos imaginable. quite a large contribution to the chaos is just me and who I am as a person, as opposed to the role, but, you know, I make it work for me. I am chaos as is my job. And, you know, combined is just a big thing of beauty, I suppose.

Fiona: 26:43

Yeah, that's, what helps you suit the role really? a Ward and a very intense locked inpatient environment can be quite chaotic. If you naturally flow with chaos, then you're the perfect person to be in there. what are you most proud of in your work? I am after one amazing story.

Kayleigh: 27:06

K, this is so difficult to answer because I couldn't even put a number on how many experiences I've had in this role that have just, made me feel full and happy and, delightful. And I think the one that I'll bring today happened most recently, which was an incredibly wonderful story, I suppose. When I very first started my role as a peer support worker three years ago, prior to being a senior, you know, first days in the big shoes of peer support, um, there was a young lady that I was working with on the ward who at the time was, really quite unwell and, struggling quite a lot, attempting to abscond quite a lot, really not engaging too much with staff on the ward or not really wanting to share her story. And I just felt so determined to get to understand this young woman. Know who she is or know what's important to her because I feel that sometimes when we're unwell, a lot of our, personality and our identity can be missing because we're put into a ward or unit where we are then seen as a patient. And that then becomes our primary identity and who we are can become lost. And that's definitely been the case for me. And I was just so keen to really get to know her and understand her. And it took a long time and it was a difficult journey for both of us, but in the end I felt I had sort of really cracked the code and I began to understand what was important to her and, she wanted to become a pastry chef and that was, a goal that she had set for herself. During her time on the ward, when she had been beginning to show signs of improvement. We were really able to carve out a plan for her and what she would do moving forward from hospital. And I think one thing that's important to know about peer support workers is that not only do we show the patients that there is a life that can be sustained with a mental health condition. We also show that to staff and I think in inpatient settings and the nature of the work that I do, it's very easy for staff to forget that after hospital, these people will go on to have lives and potentially have success, but, in an inpatient unit, you only see them when they're at their worst or when they're at the height of the crisis. And I think, we do a lot to prove to both staff and patients, what their potential is working with this wonderful young woman, I remember her being discharged and just being so grateful to me and promising me that she was going to enroll to become a pastry chef. I always feel a little bit sad when people are discharged, of course, I'm delighted that they're going to go on and continue their paths. But I always feel a little bit of sadness that I'm not going to be able to continue following their journey. I always want to see where are they going to end up. And, you know, fortunately, sometimes people end up in the community and I come across them years later, but wasn't sure if her and I would ever cross paths again and that I had so much hope for her even on her worst days. I saw so much potential in such a beautiful nature in her. About two or three weeks ago, I received a phone call from this particular lady who I had worked with three years ago in my very first days as, as a peer support worker and someone who I'm actually grateful to one of the first clients that I ever worked with. You know, she allowed me to see the value of my role and the help that I could give and allowed me to build my confidence alongside her. We helped each other and she called me a couple of weeks ago to tell me that she had gained her first role as a peer support worker herself. And the excitement and the joy in her voice was. Just the most incredible touching thing and that, I'm very glad that she's not going to go on to become a pastry chef because she has got so much offer. The minute she walked through the door and you know, this is it, it's a journey, isn't it. And now she's a peer support worker and she's going to incredible peer support worker. And it was just such a heartwarming moment for me to know that, I hope I played some part inspiring her to, to take on that role. Um, and I think the fact that she had contacted me to let me know moments after that interview would suggest, though, which is just the most wonderful and rewarding thing I could ever imagine. And yeah. I'm just delighted and I'm so proud and it warms my heart all the time, to hear that she's at where I was when I met her is just great. So yeah, that would probably be my, favorite story or at least my, most recent favorite story.

Fiona: 31:36

That's fantastic to hear.

Kayleigh: 31:39

I hope, you know, that it brings her as much fulfillment as it has brought me. And I see so many people that I work with, even in a crisis point when you were in an admission to hospital, you're in a really difficult place, I know from my own experience and yes, so many of them, I just see how compassionate they are and the way that they support each other, way that they provide support to each other and communal spaces, when you're stuck in an environment with people you wouldn't necessarily choose to be with. And you're, stuck with them, you know, you're inside, you're in a hospital often under section and the way that they pull together to support each other is probably better peer support than I could ever begin to offer any of them. So in some way, you know, they all have the potential, if they should want to on and, Take part in this beautiful career. I'm really feel that. And I see that a lot. So yeah, I hope the years I create a little army of peer support workers

Fiona: 32:37

one of your gifts is spotting potential in people um, that's so important for your work. incredibly important.

Kayleigh: 32:45

I look back to the points in my life where I was at my lowest, and I saw no potential for myself. And I think, you know, on the outside, looking in there may not have been much potential that was really held in mind for me because I, in a lot of ways, Didn't want to, you know, there wasn't anything, that really took my interest with it really set my heart on fire particularly in bouts of depression, nothing interests you. And I never thought I would find anything that is just made for me. You know, this is so made for me. And I think, yeah, had I have known about it sooner. Fortunately, I was 18 when I heard about it and it took me a long time to, get into it. But yeah, I wish it was something I had known at school. You know, people at school want to become vets or they want to become singers or actors. I think if I had, I have known about peer support as an early teenager where my problems first began, that would have been my main goal. And that would have been what I had worked towards. But Hey, we can't rewrite the past. We can only be grateful for the present.

Fiona: 33:48

Yeah, It's such a new career choice. Isn't it? I think we've, had this whole language and everything growing up around peer support and lived experience practitioner and all those different things. And I think it's, it's huge, you know, it's suddenly gone huge, but it's gone huge because it's really working well and it's, it's not like nothing's ever gone wrong. But you know, it's the same for other walks of professional life in the NHS. We're all human beings.

Kayleigh: 34:18

You could not be more right.

Fiona: 34:20

I was just thinking actually about doing an employment podcast, I've been trying to work out some way of getting service users onto my podcast, I want to do like a whole series. I think that maybe I might quite like to do one inspired by you, I suppose, called full circle where service users who've moved on very significantly and gone on to become peer support workers to come back and talk to the peer support worker that they feel, you know, really changed their lives. And, those capture those chats. To work out a couple of questions for that. That would be lovely.

Kayleigh: 34:53

that's such a beautiful idea. And I think the more Peer Support workers that there are now in years to come, those full circle moments will just be ever present and there'll be more and more people and conversations.

Fiona: 35:05

You've talked about how music is an important part of your recovery. And I haven't yet met anybody for whom music is not an important part of their recovery, to be honest. So I'm going to put you on the spot now and ask you, what is your favorite listening when you really need a boost?

Kayleigh: 35:22

Um, I think for me, that is a. Incredible artist. Her name is Tash Sultana. she has a song called jungle and this song goes through so many peaks and troughs and the tempo changes so often. And which I feel just reflects me as a person and my moods. And I feel that no matter what state of mind I'm in, I can listen to that song and it can take me to just various different places. And then after it, I don't know, I just feel Zen and calm. And it's, it's a song that you listen to intently. It's so enjoyable. I can't tell you how many times I've listened to it. Yeah, it's a beautiful song. It has so many layers to it and it builds and then it drops and this is one person. Playing every instrument included in the song and you can watch them perform this live on YouTube or watch them record it. And yeah, just to see the passion that this person has for their music is just incredible. And I'm saying then, because Tash Sultana is non binary. So I hope I have used the correct pronouns throughout this conversation, but

Fiona: 36:32

I'll edit them. I could bleep them. No, I'm not going to bleep them.

Kayleigh: 36:37

Good.

Fiona: 36:38

If somebody got somebody's pronouns wrong throughout the whole of a conversation rather than trying to overdub it, that they just bleeped it as if it was a swear word,

Kayleigh: 36:48

That's such an effective way of handling things.

Fiona: 36:52

you know, in a way that's, that's, that's a real fun way of doing that. There's something so important about getting the right pronoun. And once you've had that chat with somebody making a mistake, every so often, it's just one of those things that happen

Kayleigh: 37:06

yeah. Yeah.

Fiona: 37:08

you're being recorded, or mis-gendering somebody deliberately, which I believe does happen. Yeah, it'd be great to, aggressively beep it out, wouldn't it? I quite like that. So thank you for that. I'm going to add that to our Spotify playlist. In what seems like five minutes, we're now on the final question, which is what is your favorite biscuit and why.

Kayleigh: 37:29

This is the most pressing question that you've asked me thus far

Fiona: 37:33

It's serious. Isn't

Kayleigh: 37:34

is this is a serious question. And one that I feel the answer to will vary, depending on what day you ask me, what time of day you ask me where I'm at? You know, what beverage have I got? I think for me would have to be a custard cream.

Fiona: 37:50

Classic.

Kayleigh: 37:51

Yeah, classic custard cream. There's something comforting about a custard cream. And I think that comfort comes from our wonderful peer support worker on one of our boards at the Riverside centre, Myrna, who is just the most wonderful person is always, always fully equipped with a packet of custard creams to hand out to anyone that should need one. And I think, yeah, that just brings me a lot of comfort. Custard cream is going to have to take the biscuit.

Fiona: 38:22

That's great. Excellent. That's wonderful.

Kayleigh: 38:24

One of the real trailblazers of peer support Myrna, and someone started in the roots of peer support in addiction services and also has experiences in mental health. So I'm so fortunate to get to work alongside someone so experienced, who just keeps me so calm. Just me so much. And, and it's always on hand with a custard cream. So that would have to be my answer to the, by far the most difficult question I've been asked today.

Fiona: 38:55

So thank you so much, for being here.

Kayleigh: 38:58

Thank you for having me. And, you know, just for creating this platform for us to talk about what it is that we do, and for always being so innovative and thinking of new and fresh ways to, push peer support to the forefront of people's minds, you are, such an asset and yeah, I've really enjoyed this. It's been so nice to catch up with you and appoints actually I've forgotten. We're even being recorded. So thank you.

Fiona: 39:24

Don't forget to follow me on at Fiona The P S W on Twitter. Upcoming episodes include all sorts of very interesting people. And i very much look forward to Having you as my listener again thank you